俄羅斯總統普京接受新華社社長獨家專訪
俄羅斯總統普京接受新華社社長獨家專訪
Xinhua’s Exclusive Interview with Putin
俄羅斯總統普京訪華前夕，6月17日晚，新華社社長蔡名照在普京總統的家鄉聖彼得堡對其進行獨家專訪。在聖彼得堡國際經濟論壇會場的一個房間，普京總統興致勃勃，與蔡名照進行一對一的交流，詳細回答了蔡名照提出的關於雙邊關係、中俄經貿、上海合作組織、國際合作等問題，採訪持續了約一小時。以下爲專訪全文：
Russian President Vladimir Putin, in an hour-long exclusive interview with Xinhua President Cai Mingzhao ahead of his upcoming visit to China, elaborated his views on bilateral ties, China-Russia trade, the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO), and international cooperation, among other following is the full text of Xinhua’s exclusive interview with Putin:
蔡名照：尊敬的普京總統閣下！在您再次訪問中國前夕，我能夠在您美麗的家鄉——聖彼得堡對您進行獨家採訪，感到非常榮幸！請允許我代表新華社向您表示敬意。
Cai: Honorable President Putin, it is my great pleasure to have an exclusive interview with you here in your beautiful hometown St. Petersburg, ahead of your once-again visit to China. Please allow me to express our respect to you on behalf of Xinhua News Agency.
普京：謝謝。
Putin: Thanks.
蔡名照：在習近平主席和您的共同推動下，中俄關系正處在歷史最好時期。我相信，今天這次對您的專訪，也將有助於中俄關系的發展。請允許我開始提問。
Cai: Thanks to the joint efforts made by Chinese President Xi Jinping and you, the China-Russia relationship is currently at its best in history. I believe that today’s interview will also be conducive to our bilateral relations. Shall we start the interview please?
普京：請。
Putin: Yes, please.
蔡名照：據我們統計，習近平主席去年和您有過5次會晤，您近期又將訪問中國。在習主席和您的共同推動下，中俄全面戰略協作夥伴關係不斷深化。今年是《中俄睦鄰友好合作條約》簽署15週年，也是中俄戰略協作夥伴關係建立20週年。您認爲，當前中俄關系有哪些亮點？發展的前景如何？您對這次訪華有何期待？
Cai: According to our calculation, President Xi had five meetings with you last year. And you are visiting China again very soon. The China-Russia comprehensive strategic partnership of coordination has been deepened thanks to the joint efforts made by President Xi and year marks the 15th anniversary of the signing of the Sino-Russian Good-Neighborly Treaty of Friendship and Cooperation, as well as 20th anniversary of the establishment of the China-Russia strategic partnership of coordination. What in your opinion are the highlights of China-Russia ties? What are their future prospects? What do you expect from this visit?
普京：您說我們兩國關係處在非常高的水平，這實際上已經對我們兩國的關係作出了評價。
Putin: You said our bilateral relations are standing at a very high level, which is your comment on our bilateral ties.
我在此想提醒貴社讀者關注兩個節點。20年前，我們宣佈構建一種新型關係,即戰略協作夥伴關係；15年前，我們簽署了友好合作條約。在此期間，大量工作得以完成，使我們之間的互信達到了前所未有的高度，這種互信構成了我們雙邊合作的基礎。
Here, I want to remind Xinhua readers of two historical junctures:Twenty years ago, we announced a new type of relations – a strategic partnership; 15 years ago we signed the Sino-Russian Good-Neighborly Treaty of Friendship and Cooperation. As a lot of work has been done since then, trust between Russia and China has reached an uNPRecedented level and laid a solid foundation for bilateral cooperation.
由於我們之間的關係在過去大概從未企及這樣的水平，所以我們的專家甚至難以對我們今天所從事的共同事業的現狀給出評判。其實，簡單地稱之爲戰略協作甚至已經不夠了。因此，我們開始說它是全面戰略協作夥伴關係。“全面”意味着我們幾乎要在所有至關重要的領域開展工作。而“戰略”則表明我們正賦予它對兩國而言極其重要的意義。
Since it is a level that probably has never been reached in our relationship in the past, it is very hard for our experts to define today’s common cause that binds our two countries together. In fact, it is not enough now to simply call it a strategic coordination. Therefore, we started to call it “a comprehensive strategic partnership of coordination.” The word “comprehensive” means that we are cooperating on almost all vital areas, and “strategic” demonstrates the prime importance we are attaching to our relationship.
您提及了我與習近平主席之間的協作。的確如此。我跟他之間的工作，我們這一層面的工作，當然是兩國關係發展毋庸置疑的驅動器，起着促進作用。我們在自身層面上討論相互協作戰略中的基礎性問題。習近平主席本人非常重視俄中關係的發展。他是很好的朋友、非常可靠的夥伴。
You mentioned the coordination between President Xi and me. Indeed, the work between us, the work at our level, serves without doubt as an engine for the development of bilateral relations. We are currently discussing together some basic issues in our cooperative strategy. President Xi himself values a lot the development of Russia-China relations. He is a very good friend and reliable partner.
然而要想實現俄中關係的順利發展，僅憑我們的努力是不夠的。爲此，當然需要進一步完善俄羅斯聯邦與中華人民共和國政府之間的工作機制。兩國政府首腦定期舉行會晤。20多個分委會、政府間委員會組建起來，我記得有26個分委會，在這些機構當中，所有同仁非常高效而緊張地工作着。我們遠非總是能夠就複雜的問題迅速達成一致，但所有問題，無論多麼複雜，我們都能讓它們服務於共同的目標，即推動彼此之間的合作，所以我們總能找到解決之策。
However, the smooth growth of Russia-China ties cannot merely depend on our efforts. It calls for further improving the working mechanism between the governments of the Russian Federation and the People’s Republic of China. The heads of government of our two countries meet on a regular basis. More than 20 sub-commissions and intergovernmental commissions have been set up – I believe there are 26 sub-commissions in fact. People in these commissions are working diligently and efficiently. Although the two countries are still far from being able to swiftly reach consensus on every complicated problem, we always share the common goal of pushing forward our cooperation no matter how complex the issues are. So we always find a solution.
世界經濟面臨衆所周知的難關，這也體現到我們的協作當中，兩國商品貿易總額有所下降。但我們相信，這是暫時現象，與個別商品當前的行情和匯率差異有關。與此同時，我們得以着手解決主要問題。在改善雙邊貿易結構方面，我們採取了實質性的舉措。
The difficulties that the global economy is going through are widely known. They are also reflected in the coordination between the two countries. For instance, the trade volume between Russia and China has declined a bit. But we believe it is merely a temporary downtick resulting from the current market prices of certain commodities and differences in exchange rates. Meanwhile, actions have been taken to solve the major problems. To optimize the bilateral trade structure, we have taken some substantial actions.
我此刻可能會記錯，需要查閱相關統計資料，近1年來，我國對中國出口的機械技術產品總量出現了顯著增長，我記得增幅達到了44%。對我們而言，這至爲重要。我們曾就此問題與中方夥伴討論過多年。我想感謝我們的朋友，讓我們在這一最重要的方向上經營出如此的局面，逐步實現既定目標。這是我們共同的目標。我們就此已達成共識，並朝着所需方向共同前行。
I may not remember correctly and may need to check up, over the past year, Russian export of mechanical and technical products to China has grown significantly, by 44 percent. This means a lot to us. We have been negotiating this with the Chinese partners for years. I want to thank our friends for making this a reality, which makes it possible for us to gradually realize our goals in the most important direction. This is our common goal, which we have consensus with. We are going forward together in the direction that we need to go.
因此，最重要的方向當然是實現雙邊貿易往來多元化，賦予其更優秀的特質，我指的是提升對雙邊合作中高技術領域的關注。
Therefore, the most important task in bilateral relations is bringing diversities and higher quality to trade relations, particularly boosting cooperation in high-tech areas.
在航天計劃和航空領域，我們同樣攜手工作，聯合研發寬體飛機和重型直升機。我們共同解決生態問題，繼續在能源領域實施規模非常龐大的項目，其中便包括核能。
We are also working together in the fields of space projects and aviation, notably with a joint research on wide-body airplanes and heavy-weight helicopters. We are jointly seeking solutions to ecological problems and continue to launch giant programs in the field of energy, including nuclear energy.
蔡名照：俄羅斯在這些方面有很多優勢。
Cai: Russia has a lot of strength in these sectors.
普京：的確如此。俄羅斯國家原子能公司的訂單數量相當可觀。田灣核電站的兩個機組已運營了8年，擁有非常好的口碑。我們還在興建兩個機組，我認爲這並非終點。我們應當擴大彼此合作，不只是增加中國核電站的數量，還要拓寬在該領域的科技協作。
Putin: Indeed, yes. Rosatom (Russian state-owned nuclear corporation) has a remarkable orderbook. The two reactor units at Tianwan Nuclear Power Plant have been operating for eight years and have been recognized for their performance. We are building two more reactor units and I don’t think we will stop there. We should expand our cooperation, not just building more nuclear power plants in China but also broaden our technological collaboration in this respect.
中國正逐步強化在我國能源市場上的存在。中國是我國“亞馬爾液化氣”這一重大項目的大股東之一，併購買了我國最頂尖的化學控股公司之一——西伯利亞—烏拉爾石油化學和天然氣公司10%的股份。我們對上述中國投資表示歡迎，不單是因爲有資金注入，同時也是出於深化我們之間夥伴關係的考量。
China is now gradually strengthening its presence in our energy market. Not only it’s one of the main shareholders of the Yamal LNG plant, an important liquefied natural gas mega-project, but also China bought 10 percent of the shares of the Siberian-Ural Petrochemical and Gas Company, one of the top chemical shareholding companies in Russia. We welcome such investment by China, not only because of capital inflows but also because it helps deepen our partnership.
在著名的“莫斯科—喀山”高鐵項目上，工作進展非常順利，部分路段時速可望達到400公里。我們密切關注這一項目的進展，這可能僅僅是兩國基礎設施大規模合作的開始。
On the famous Moscow-Kazan high-speed railway line, we are seeing very good progress, and we are expecting a speed of up to 400 km per hour at some segments. We are closely following the work on the projects, and it may very well be only the beginning of our broad cooperation in infrastructure.
我們在人文領域的合作同樣十分重要，這包括在我們兩國輪流舉辦的中國年、俄羅斯年、青年友好交流年、俄語年、漢語年、旅遊年等。其中一部分活動是俄方提議舉行的，另一部分活動由中方首先提出倡議。所有活動都非常成功，它們無疑將有助於營造兩國人民之間的互信氛圍。這些活動的重要性不亞於“西伯利亞力量”這樣的重大能源項目，這裏指的是俄羅斯向中國每年輸送380億立方米天然氣的俄中東線天然氣管道項目。此外，俄中兩國在外交、軍事和軍事技術領域的合作也穩步推進。
Our cooperation in culture is also of great value, including the Chinese Year and Russia Year, held alternately in our two countries, the Sino-Russian Youth Friendship Exchange Year, the Russian and Chinese Language Year, the Tourism Year, etc. Some of these were proposed by Russia while others were initiated by China. All of them have been very successful and will undoubtedly promote the mutual trust between our two peoples. The importance of these activities is no less than that of mega energy projects like the “Power of Siberia,” by which I am referring to the eastern gas pipe project between Russia and China that supplies China with 38 billion cubic meters of gas annually. Apart from this, we have also had steady progress in cooperation on international and military affairs and on military technologies.
我們通常都在會晤時討論所有這些問題。您知道，訪問日程排得很滿，甚至可以說非常滿。因此我期待像往常那樣與習近平主席在友好互信的氣氛中舉行內容豐富的會談。
We usually discuss all these cooperation when President Xi and I meet. You know, my upcoming visit had packed schedules, very packed actually. So I expect to have friendly meetings with President Xi on a broad range of topics, with mutual trust, as we have always had.蔡名照：謝謝。剛纔您提到了中俄兩國的經貿發展，很多大型項目非常令人鼓舞。您多次
調，要推動歐亞經濟聯盟與中國“一帶一路”倡議進行對接，中國經濟界非常關心這件事。具體將採取哪些措施？又如何藉助“一帶一路”建設與歐亞經濟聯盟對接來提升中俄經貿水平？
Cai: Thank you. You mentioned the growth of economic and trade cooperation, and a lot of the mega cooperation projects, which are very encouraging. You have said many times that we should align the Eurasian Economic Union (EEU) with the Belt and Road Initiative proposed by China. China’s economic sector is following this closely. So specifically what do you suggest the two countries do in this respect? How can we leverage on the alignment of these development plans to promote the economic and trade cooperation between China and Russia?
普京：您提到了一個很有意思的重大話題。我們知道，習近平主席提出了“絲綢之路經濟帶”的倡議。我們認爲，他的倡議非常及時，令人感興趣，並擁有廣闊前景，其目的是擴大同世界各國的合作。當然，首先是同鄰國的合作，因爲無論這條路通向何處，首先都要途經鄰國。
Putin: What you’ve raised is an interesting topic. We know that President Xi Jinping put forward the Silk Road Economic Belt. We think that Xi’s proposal is very well-timed and appealing, and the Initiative holds great potential as it aims to expand China’s cooperation with the world. China’s neighbors naturally come first in such cooperation, as the road, wherever it leads to eventually, first goes through the neighboring countries.
我們正在進行兩方面的談判：一方面是俄中雙邊談判，另一方面是涉及中國和歐亞經濟聯盟的談判。就在不久前，我們歐亞經濟聯盟五國在阿斯塔納討論過相關內容。大家都贊成在習近平主席提出的“絲綢之路經濟帶”框架內發展我們同中國的合作。
We are undertaking two negotiations: one is bilateral between Russia and China, and the other is between China and the EEU. Just recently, the five member countries of the EEU discussed relevant issues in Astana (the capital of Kazakhstan). We all agreed to develop our cooperation with China within the framework of the Silk Road Economic Belt Initiative.
我對您絕對坦誠：我們當然要考慮本國商品生產者的利益。但一致的看法是，世界經濟發展和我們與中國合作的根本道路應該是爲開放的共同事業逐步消除各種障礙。這樣，可以在第一階段建立自貿區。
I have to be absolutely frank with you. Of course, we do have to take care of the interests of our producers. But we share the consensus that our fundamental approach to world economic development and our cooperation with China is to gradually eliminate the various barriers to our common cause of opening up. So I think what we can do at the first stage is to establish a free trade area.
我們是現實主義者。我們明白，第一階段不可能沒有任何例外和特殊情況，但是我們應該指明前進方向。爲了達到這個目的，考慮到本地區越來越多的國家對我們的合作感興趣，我們會爲今天我稱之爲歐亞合作的概念創造先決條件。爲此，我們會努力避免建立封閉的經貿集團。
We are realists. We are aware that it is impossible at the first stage to rule out exceptions and special cases, but we should be clear about where we want to go. Given that more and more countries in our region are enthusiastic about our cooperation, in order to achieve our aim, we shall try to create favorable conditions for what we call Eurasian cooperation, and we shall try to avoid establishing a closed economic and trade bloc.
蔡名照：謝謝。我們知道上海合作組織峯會很快將在塔什干舉行。上合組織已經成立15年了，中俄兩國都是上合組織的創始國，這個組織在保障地區安全、促進地區發展方面發揮着重要作用。您對本次上合組織峯會有何期待，對上合機制有何評價？
Cai: Thank you. The 16th summit of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) is to be held in the Uzbek capital of Tashkent. Established 15 years ago, the SCO, with both China and Russia as founding member states, has played an important role in boosting regional security and development. What’s your anticipation for the upcoming summit? And what do you think of the SCO mechanism?
普京：上海合作組織在成立之初，爲自己提出了相當低調的目標。我想說，這些目標很重要，卻也注重實利，那就是要解決種種或難或易的邊境合作問題，但畢竟只是邊境合作問題。不過我們也知道，如果缺乏誠意，這些邊境問題可能數十年都懸而不決；而如果有誠意，這些問題便迎刃而解。這在很大程度上取決於一個國家的內部情勢以及它在國際舞臺上的處世哲學。
Putin: The SCO, at its early days, set itself pretty low-profile goals. I want to say those goals were both important and pragmatic, which were aimed at addressing various kinds of problems in cooperation along the borders. However, whether they are easy or not, those issues were still no more than cooperation along the borders. But we are aware that those issues would have stayed unsolved for decades without sincerity and could be easily solved with enough sincerity. Whether those issues could be solved or not depends on a country’s internal situation and how it conducts itself on the world stage, to a great extent.
俄羅斯、中國以及上海合作組織的其他成員正是基於這種最大的誠意，實現了我們在這一領域爲自己設立的所有目標。顯然，我們不能放棄這一機制，要珍惜所取得的成果，珍惜我們各成員國之間相互關係的發展水平。事實上，我們已經開始利用現有機制來解決其他問題，首先是開展多領域合作。這裏既包括政治上的合作，也包括基礎設施建設方面的合作。我們已經開始討論安全問題、應對毒品威脅等等。
It was based on their utmost sincerity that Russia, China and other SCO member states achieved all of the pre-set goals in this area. Obviously, it is advisable for us not to abandon this mechanism and to cherish our achievements as well as the current development level of the inter-relations among all the SCO member states. As a matter of fact, we have begun to solve other problems through the SCO mechanism, starting with cooperation in a number of fields. Such cooperation is not only political but also involves infrastructure construction. We have also begun to discuss issues concerning security and drug trafficking, among others.
我不會說，我們已經取得了很多神奇的成果，實施了一系列模範行動。但我要說，這一組織已成爲本地區受歡迎的、富有吸引力的組織。世界上很多國家已表示期望加入上海合作組織。
I will not say that we have achieved many magical results or that we have carried out a series of exemplary operations. But I will say the SCO has become a popular and attractive organization in the region. Many countries around the world have expressed willingness to join it.
在去年舉行的上海合作組織烏法峯會上，我們決定啓動接收印度和巴基斯坦加入上合組織的程序。在塔什干峯會上，我們將落實這一決定。我們還將討論其他國家希望參與上合組織工作的問題。
At the SCO Ufa Summit last year, we decided to initiate the procedure of admitting India and Pakistan into the bloc. At the Tashkent summit, we will implement the decision and hold discussions on other countries’ willingness to participate in the work of the organization.
上海合作組織職能範圍的擴大、成員數量的增加，特別是上述重要國家的加入，使得這一組織成爲一個不僅在本地區、而且在世界範圍內都具有權威性的、受歡迎的國際組織。
The expansion of the SCO’s functions and the increase in its member numbers, particularly the inclusion of those important countries mentioned above, have made it an authoritative and popular international organization in the region and the world at large.
國際形勢複雜多樣。一些國家在這樣或那樣的國際問題上立場和觀點不盡相同。他們加入我們的組織雖然無法解決問題本身，但是會爲問題的解決創造條件。我們對此充滿期待。
As the international situation is complex and diverse, some countries might differ from others in terms of stance and opinion over certain international issues. Although their inclusion into the SCO might not offer solution to their disagreements, we will make efforts in paving the way for the settlement of those issues. We are full of expectations for that.
蔡名照：謝謝。當今世界面臨着許多重大挑戰，全球經濟復甦乏力，一些地區局勢動盪，恐怖活動加劇，氣候變化等環境問題也很突出。在這種艱難的國際環境下，中俄兩國作爲有影響力、負責任的大國，是維護世界和平與穩定的重要力量。您認爲中俄兩國在維護世界和平、完善全球治理方面還應該做出哪些努力？
Cai: Thank you. Today, the world faces many grave challenges, including a sluggish global economic recovery, instability and volatility in some regions, rampant terrorist activities, and environmental problems such as climate change. As two influential and responsible major countries, China and Russia are important forces in maintaining world peace and stability, especially under such challenging international situations. So, what additional efforts do you think China and Russia should make to maintain world peace and improve global governance?
普京：如您所知，俄羅斯和中國目前在國際舞臺上進行協作這件事本身就是國際事務中的穩定因素。
Putin: As you know, coordination between Russia and China on the global stage is itself a stabilizing factor in international affairs.
讓我們來回顧一下習近平主席在出席聯合國成立70周年紀念活動時的講話吧。請再次重溫。這一講話旨在以國際法爲準繩、通過和平手段解決所有爭議問題。與此同時，習近平主席還表示願意幫助貧窮國家，甚至還針對這些建議提出具體措施。他是爲數不多的致力於國際減貧的國家領導人之一。在國際事務中把我們團結在一起的正是這些立場，而不僅僅是我們兩國地理位置上相近。
Let’s recall Chinese President Xi Jinping’s address at the ceremony marking the 70th anniversary of the establishment of the United Nations. Please recall his words. He advocated for all controversial issues to be resolved in accordance with international law and through peaceful means only. President Xi also said China stands ready to aid poor countries, and even put forward specific measures accordingly. He is one of the few national leaders who are dedicated to international poverty reduction. It is these positions, instead of just geographic proximity, that unite us in international affairs.
除了在上海合作組織內進行合作，我們也在金磚國家框架內開展合作，金磚國家機制實際上也是我們共同創立的。我們還在聯合國這個平臺上積極合作。
Apart from our cooperation within the framework of the SCO, we have been cooperating with each other within the BRICS framework as well. Actually, we jointly created the BRICS mechanism. We also have active cooperation with each other at the United Nations.
我想回顧一下，正是我國，當時的蘇聯，竭盡全力使中華人民共和國在聯合國安理會常任理事國中取得了值得尊敬的位置。我們一直認爲，這就是中華人民共和國的位置。直到今天，我們一直很高興發生這件事，因爲我們對國際事務所持的觀點，用外交語言來說，非常相似或完全一致。這種觀點的吻合在技術層面上得以充實。我們保持經常性接觸，並就全球和地區問題進行磋商。我們彼此視對方爲親密盟友，因此理所當然始終傾聽夥伴的聲音，我指的是照顧彼此利益。
In retrospect, it was my country, the then Soviet Union, that tried its best to help the People’s Republic of China secure its permanent seat at the UN Security Council, a respectable place where we always think China should be. Until today, we have always been very happy that this happened, as our two countries, in the language of diplomacy, have the same or very similar viewpoints in international affairs. Such alignment of our stances is also substantiated at the technical level. We have maintained contact regularly, and carried out consultations on global and regional affairs. We see each other as close allies, so of course we always listen to each other, by this I mean we keep in mind each other’s interests.
我相信，在我訪問中華人民共和國期間，我們的合作也將遵循這一精神。
I believe that during my visit to the People’s Republic of China, our cooperation will continue to follow this spirit.
蔡名照：謝謝總統閣下，我們衷心期待您對中國的訪問。祝您這次訪華取得圓滿成功。我還想告訴您，在您此次訪問期間，新華社和塔斯社也將簽署一份新的合作協定。
Cai: Thank you, Mr. President. We sincerely look forward to your visit to China and wish you enormous success. I would also like to tell you that during your visit, Xinhua News Agency and Tass News Agency will sign a new cooperative agreement.
普京：您在這件事上幫助了我們。謝謝您，因爲在當今世界，新聞報道的重要性不亞於外交官的實際工作。
Putin: You have been a great help on this front. Thank you. In today’s world, the work of news reporting is no less important than that of diplomats.
